The following was taken from postings to the Scouts-L e-mail discussion list and is a rich treasure trove of information about how Scouts and Commissioners see roundtables. Gary Apfelstadt conducted a survey of online Scouters and posted the results to share with other Scouters. The results can tell us a good deal about what works and doesn't work at Roundtables. In any case all of this is great for starting the thinking process - how can I improve my Roundtable and do a better job of serving Scouters?

The following material is from his postings with some editing for web formatting:

Recently, I posted three sections for an E Rdtble Survey. With some members
on Scouts-L I hoped to learn about your experiences with District
Roundtables, to gather information that will be useful for the building of
and reflection on my district's Cub Scout & Boy Scout Roundtables, and to
post the gathered information on SCOUTS-L to aid your program reviews as well.

As with surveys generally, I have ended up with more questions from the
results.

Many thanks are owed for the cooperation of the wired Scouters on SCOUTS-L

Please feel free to contact me by email if you have a question, or further
observation.

YIS, Gary Apfelstadt, Prairielands Council, Champaign, IL

Included here will be some observations drawn from the Surveys, and all the
comments shared from your experiences.

Number of responses by survey segment

        E I Rdtble Survey - 20
        E II Rdtble Survey -19
        E III Rdtble Survey - 11

Number of scouters replying - 24

Points of origin for scouters

        Unidentified -08
        NM, TX, AZ(2), NY, MD, WI, NH, OH, CA(2), WA, NE, GA, KS, MI

Months of Best Attendance (# citations)

        Sept (9), Oct (6), Apr (5), When timed with Events (3)

Months of Worst Attendance (# citations)

        Summer (8), Dec (6), Jan (3), Feb (2)

Rdtble Program characteristics:

        Run by District Executive
                - No (17), Yes (1)
        Rdtble follows BSA Monthly Themes
                - CS Rdtble 100%
                - BS Rdtble   50%
        Draws on Specialists outside of scout unit leaders
                - CS Rdtble 70%
                - BS Rdtble  100%
        Assigns duties to units for future programs
                - CS Rdtble 70%
                - BS Rdtble  50%

Rdtble Promotion characteristics:

        Uses attendance incentives
                - CS Rdtble 60%
                - BS Rdtble  30%
        Uses newsletter publicity
                - CS Rdtble 50%
                - BS Rdtble  50%

Rdtble Commissioner & staff characteristics:

Train-the-Trainer syllabus training (BSA pub # 34168)

- CS Rdtble 100%
- BS Rdtble  100%

Roundtable Commissioner & Staff syllabus training

(Boy Scout Rdtble pub # 34256)

(Cub Scout Rdtble pub # 33013)

- CS Rdtble 70%
- BS Rdtble  100%

Additional Shared Comments on a variety of topics:

Reasons for best attendance ?
 
        - Because of new leaders needing to network and in November, our
          having the Webelos Looky Lou so the troops are able to 'show  
          their stuff'and the Webelos and their parents can get an idea 
          of the troops in the district; which ones to visit and possibly 
          join., with over 90% of the units represented.
        - May was Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat cert for all in attendance.
        - Most new leaders curious as to what RT is.
        - New Cub Scout leaders are looking for all the information they can get.
          Boy Scout leaders are finding out the year's schedule of topics.
        - Camporee information given
        - Schoolnight programs
        - The program kickoff helps units get the new year started - materials for
          sign-up, for Scouting for food, for popcorn sales.  Council
          promotes this heavily with flyers, mailings, articles in district 
          monthly newspaper.
        - Leaders are interested in Roundups and Recharters.
        - Leader curiosity.
        - These Roundtables are mainly program planning where a lot of
          district/council information is dispersed.
        - I think it is because it is right after school nite for scouting in
          august when we get all the new leaders.
        - No vacations, school is in session, too cold to take long trips.
        - It is the start of the year cycle, and everyone is excited and fired up.
        - Schoolnight recruiting.
        - New leaders, new program year, much info. to distribute
        - New Cub Scout leaders are looking for all the information they can get.
          Boy Scout leaders are finding out the year's schedule of topics.
        - Looking for ideas for starting out, camporees, etc.
        - New leaders come for new ideas ... or when they need thought starters.
        - New year what's going on--Planning for Camporee.
        - Scouters need last minute details for rechartering and camporees.
        - The most pertinent information is presented at program kickoff.

Reasons for worst attendance ?
        - June has many different graduation/awards nights and December 
          has far too many plays/vacations, etc.
        - No clear theme promoted.
        - School's out
        - We meet early in the month (1st Thursday).  Between Wisconsin 
          winter and the holidays its very difficult to get them out.  
          It then becomes an annual task to get them back.
        - Summer activities
        - We don't meet in the usual place (the college closes during the summer)
          and most leaders have many other activities drawing on their time 
          (little league, summer camps, 4-H, etc.
        - Holidays
        - Other priorities.
        - Busy schedules and troop programs and,  very little district/council
          information available.
        - Communications & busy summer schedules.
        - Graduation, school ending, vacation planning,  etc.
        - Dec/Jan because of the nearness of holidays, and  the large number of
          other activities scheduled for that time of year. May - Other 
          than it is the end of the school year, I don't know.
        - Summer schedules.
        - Busy scouting.
        - Too many other priorities.
        - Holiday time.
        - Most additional commitments that conflict with dates
        - Too many other things going on at that time.


Describe attendance incentives ?
        - minimal Please describe: beads for attendance, extra bead for in uniform,
          small door prizes
        - Not formally other than small, but nice, prizes are given out monthly
          for contests, etc.  Have in the past recognized Troops with the best 
          annual attendance and/or most bodies at a monthly RT.
        - I give each new participant a plastic arrowhead on a leather thong. each
          time they come they get a bead to add to the arrowhead.  (yes, I buy them
          myself, but you know how much an adult will do for a bead :)
        - Different color "pony beads" for each RT attended.
        - We have a large stuffed Koala in Cub Uniform that goes to the Pack with
          the most leaders in  attendance.  He participates with them, and then
          returns the following month.
        - Our attendance incentives are for the troop with the highest %
          attendance of leaders, a pennant for their flag, The totem to 
          decorate and the responsibility to bring refreshments to the next 
          meeting. Individuals get a gold bead for their wampum every third 
          meeting in a row they attend, absences must be excused or you 
          start from zero. After five years, a guy just got his one
          year award last Thursday. Twelve meetings earns a miniature 
          headdress to wear around your neck. Then additional decorations 
          for the headdress every sixth meeting.
        - The best way to encourage attendance is to Put on a GOOD PROGRAM!
        - We have a drawing for a donated dinner for two with chances based on
          slips filled out each month when you sign in.  The more you attend the
          better the chance you have.  We also recognize attendance at the 
          district dinner--certificates, etc.
        - Beads for each R/T, activity attempted.
        - We're considering various possibilities beads, door prizes, rewards to
          units with highest attendance
        - Last incentive gave prizes for units with biggest leader attendance over
          3 months.  Prizes included donated lumber, a staff-led Woodcraft event, etc.
        - Awards, Handouts for Patrol Leaders Helper Notebook, Aggressive Recruiting


Other comments ?

Not being able to have our meetings at the same place over the past 2
years has caused havoc with our attendance.  We are trying to do the best
with what we have but it does get difficult to put on a program when the
size and rules have to be changed.

More promotion of what was going to be happening would probably enhance
attendance.  Scouters need to see a real value in attending in order to get
another night out of them.

Quality very definitely depends on the RT Commissioner.  In general our
RTs have been a one man effort, although frequently Units and/or outside
speakers are part of the program.  I feel we could do a lot more sharing 
of programideas with the right format.  I have probably attended 90% of 
the Dist. RT's in the past 30 years and  generally learn something new 
every time. However, attendance is usually made up of the same 30% of 
the SM's.

We have recently increased attendance due to some changes: one, I cut
back the meetings to 1 and 1/2 hours.  previous commissioner was keeping us
there 2 to 2 1/2 hours. Second, I took a survey of what the participants
wanted. So now, each month, we have a special topic of interest.  some 
agenda items were:  skits, crafts, cooking, sports and academics, etc.  
the staff is assigned the topic based on their expertise.

I don't really like the current organization - that of Patrols & Troop,
as I think that it is harder to administer than having a volunteer or the
RTC arrange the theme.

We also have door prizes, handouts and theme-related wampum beads.

Like everything else, Roundtable seems cyclical.  Right now I have two
great RT Commissioners (for Scouts and Cubs) who have fun, sing, and put on
a GOOD PROGRAM.  This results in about 95% of these units attending.  We don't
currently offer anything specifically for Explorers, so only our High
Adventure Posts regularly attend, since they can often use the info.
intended for Scouts.

I've enjoyed Roundtables when I've gone (especially when I was CC of my
son's Pack, less so now I am a MC in my son's Troop), but have never been
close to the planning, etc., nor have I kept track of attendance, etc.

For our Sea Explorer units (7 total), We have quarterly Squadron
Quarterdeck  meetings. These are always well attended. We have dinner,
discuss our calendar, help ships with their problems, boats, plans, etc. 
The youth go into a separate room to discuss the program, activities, etc. 
We all get back together and the Squadron Chief Boatswain makes the report. 
Then, we all see how we can make our program better. Last, I 
(squadron commodore) tell about exciting activities and events and ask 
for comments. Last is the commodore's minute.

When I took over 6 years ago, attendance averaged 8 or 9 troops and in
some months  only one or two Cub Scouters.  I look at it that we are
getting to about 75 to 80 percent of the units.  It has proven to be
difficult if not impossible to crack the nut of the last 20 to 25 percent.
I would appreciate it if you would pass on the findings of your survey -
they may help to reach our "other" units.

Strongly dependent on intangibles such as perceived distance to R/T,
synergy of R/Ts, competence of R/T staff and their ability to make them
interesting.

We've tried reminder postcards and notes in the council newsletter, but
still have dropping attendance.  We *know* the program is good because
those who attend give us compliments. We *don't* know why we can't 
seem to get more people to attend.

I "publish" a Cub Scout RT help that's 50+ pages each month.  I trade
them with  Scouters across the country.  Write me for details or a sample
.

We have recently split the district but only lost 3 units that used  to
come to the R/T.  The others did not come anyway.

Scouters want real usable information presented in a timely, interesting
manner.  When they know this will happen, they will come.

Unit program responsibility ?

the BS RT commissioner finds new people each month to do a
presentation, which he promotes at the previous RT

At the beginning of each school year each unit is asked to lead a
monthly Roundtable usually on the subject of the following month's theme.

generally troops are not approached individually. My feeling is that
troops don't get a lot of consideration. The offer is generally made, but
with the exception of the main topic (speaker) troops have not taken 
a major role in other program areas (i.e. preopenings, openings, etc.).

A specific individual, usually a pack leader will provide a portion of
the program, but outside resource leaders provide at least half of the
presentations.

Units are scheduled to provide opening, closing, skits, songs, snacks.

We have about 12-18 attending each month, so we don't do further
breakouts from the general Cub RT session.  We try to include these
features each month: Skit, Craft, Game, Webelos, Other (special
presentations), Treats.

At the beginning of the year monthly topics for Boy Scouts are
determined.  Presenters are then recruited, in part from district people.

We rotate asking a unit to provide; (1) Menu of the month. (2) Hike of
the month. R/T leader has a (1) Quiz of month (past issues of Scouter). (2)
Song of the month with printed words for all.

One unit each month is asked to provide an opening and closing ceremony and
refreshments.

Outside of Scouting program resources ?

City & local programs (our district covers 7 cities), Military programs
(reserve base, naval weapons station), Regional parks, etc.

Red Cross and Disaster Preparedness have been recent speakers

Our last program had representatives from "E company of the 2nd
Wisconsin Brigade" a Civil War reenactment group.  The year before, we had
a representative from the Department of Natural Resources.

Health club manager in regards to Physical Fitness and boy development


Ambulance Co. Manager in regards to First Aid Community -- Civic Club
President talking about community beautification/good turns/government --
Forrest Service Mgr. with regard to forestry planning and opportunities for
Troops.  -- Local REI representative talking about equipment -- Outdoor
Store representative talking about mainly biking (trails and equipment).

Science Center Presentation by employee, Archeologist on Indian digs in
the area, Indian enthusiast on building and keeping a "kit", Cub camp
promotion from district committee,  amateur astronomer on sights in 
the sky,  bird watcher on migratory birds.

Sheriff's Aid, Food Bank Rep, Wildlife Rehab Worker...

A presentation on taxes by a former IRS agent, A discussion on school
leadership by a school board member.

Unit leaders are often asked to contribute in their area of expertise
e.g. cooking, working with ADD/ADHD kids, whatever.

Two this year come to mind: County Sheriffs and police on gang and drug
awareness and a social worker on ADD (she is a mother of a Scout but not a
Scouter.

We use local craft shops, library resources and  magazines to supplement
our program.

Sometimes we have had REI people come and give demonstration on camping
equipment.

Hobbyists bring in their unique expertise in crafts, wood, etc.  We've
brought in a psychologist to discuss ADD.  Red Cross to discuss emergency
preparedness.

An outfitter who spoke on gear, an EMT who reviewed proper first-aid
kits, somebody from the Dept. of Environmental Conservation, speaking on
programs available for kids... maybe others, this is all I remember 
at the moment.

Other comments ?

It's a great place to come and find fellowship and to find out who's
our newest District Executive.

From what our District Executive says, our district has one of the best
Roundtables in the council.  I think that attendance could be much better.
I try to encourage my Den Leaders to come but most of them are also involved in
other Youth programs and find it difficult to get away on an additional
night for a Cub Scout Roundtable.  All of my leaders have at least been to
Basic Leader Training and over half have been to a Pow-wow so I don't push
the issue too much.

In general the stronger troops attend - probably because these SM's are
willing to put in the necessary time and effort.

Even though we get a good caliber of presenters, the number of units
represented at the Roundtable continues to dwindle.  Unit leaders attend
because of the resources available to them and the amount of fun that they
can enjoy.

The Roundtable is organized into patrols, according to Troop#.  Each
Patrol has a responsibility for the meeting.  (setup, opening, prog 1-4 -
etc.)  I am personally not in agreement with this method

We are suffering the after-effects of a rancorous merger.  Most
attendees see the current RT as an extension of _one_ of the two districts
merged.  "We lost, mentality.  It was definitely poorly  handled.

Only attended year-end district recognition event once, when one of our
Scouters was being honored.


We have a new Boy Scout RT Commissioner who is going to start planning
the RT's around the program helps themes (beginning in Sept.) We are also
about to begin a weekly e-mail reminder that we hope will help with RT attendance,
which has been flagging of late.

How do you pay for Roundtable supplies ?
        - Cake Raffle and donations
        - I use company supplies but as little as possible
        - out of pocket
        - Begging
        - I generally pay for them. I get the copying done for 
          free at the office as long as I don't go overboard.
        - The staff is responsible for their own handouts and supplies. 
          (and yes, it can get costly).
        - RT Staff submits request for reimbursement to Council.
        - Donations and a little from council.
        - Donated by businesses of staffers ... or by staffers.  Some materials
          paid for by training budget.


Other comments ?

Roundtable doesn't seem to have the same support that Council once
placed on its importance since it's returned to 'Training instead of
Commissioner' heading. With the supplemental training (required) provided
at Roundtable (for Cubs) it definitely takes a lot away from the "fun" part
of Roundtable Program and adds somewhat of a nightmare to the tracking of
who's trained and who's not or what now constitutes a Trained Leader.
Roundtable is a monthly training session but before now it has been
more like the boys receive the program, learning through fun.  I just
hope they know what they're doing and not just trying to justify the 4
hour Basic Training and causing another failure.

On copies, I provide my own handouts. Others provide theirs, the church
where we meet allows use of their copy machine if you bring your own
paper.

Also, 6 of 10 staffers are Woodbadge trained, 4 Cub Scout, 2 Boy Scout
and one both.

The DE usually has about 5-7 minutes of announcements.

We just started for the summer meetings which are outdoor potlucks.  I
plan to publish a list of the Cub RT meeting themes and/or special
presentations for the year (Sept-Aug) to be handed out at the Aug RT
(Program Preview).

Next year, I'll take what our council calls Master of RT Comm training.

We generally get the same people to attend month after month.  I'm
looking for ways (inexpensive) to blow new life into the meetings to
increase attendance. On a good note, there is probably only about 3 Cub
units that never attend any session in a given year.

I make out the topic, opening and closing assignments and then present
them to the  staff.  It makes the planning meeting extremely short as they
usually have no problem with it and appreciate knowing several months ahead
of time what
to prepare.

Our district exec makes his announcements and is available during the
meeting /breakouts for anyone that wants to talk to him.

We have the staff wear neckerchiefs, slides or hats to match the theme.

Themed activities are extensively covered in the 50+ page handouts we
produce.Training sessions at RT may include themed activities (ceremonies,
crafts),
but often do not.

Our old District (gone) used to have the program planned by the RTC.
Attendance was sporadic, and seating was open. After a merger of Districts,
we began to do RTs the 'other' way. They organized RT patrols by troop
affiliation.  Every patrol consists of 8 or so units.  The problem that I
have is that RT attendance is volatile. Some troops send one leader to RT
each month (& rotate the leader). This not surprisingly breaks continuity.

(cont'd) Another problem that I see with this Patrol/troop method is that
the program presenters generally miss out on the other important programs.
Our last RT was on Safe Swim Defence. I provided handouts courtesy of my
employer.  There was no reason to have my whole RT Patrol there for the
presentation so I sent them to other sessions to pick up on that information.

(cont'd) We would be better off having a longer program without breaks,
but I don't complain too loudly because I don't want to be RTC next year.

(cont'd) We still do have a 50/50 raffle at RT. We had door prizes in the
Old District as well as refreshments. Now we have none.


Appropriate(d) Quotes from E Scouters:

The nice thing about teamwork is that someone is always on your side!